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Episode 6

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Published on:

4th Nov 2024

Venom: The Last Dance - Deep Dive

Join us for this latest installment of Cape or Cap, where we dive deep into Venom: The Last Dance!

Last week was Halloween so this week, we’re reviewing Sony's latest film closing the story of their anti-hero lethal protector Venom in Venom: The Last Dance - we're talking symbiotes, Eddie Brock’s journey, and the most terrifying thing of all: whether the last dance was an elegant tango or that awkward grinding on the dance floor. We’ll break down the plot, dissect the characters, and answer your burning questions:

  • Is this good storytelling?
  • How does it compare to other films, comics, and larger narratives?
  • What was happening behind the scenes during the creation of this production and after its release?
  • And as always, is this a "cape" or a "cap"?

00:41:47 Cape or Cap Verdict

Referenced Materials:

Hosts: Chamar Griffith and Andrew Tejada

Producers: Chamar Griffith and Andrew Tejada

Support Cape or Cap by donating once today or monthly. Follow the show on social media @capeorcap and share your thoughts with us through a direct message or email at capeorcappod@gmail.com.

Like and Subscribe to our YouTube page, and listen to the rest of the episodes wherever you get your podcasts!

Transcript
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So he turns into Venom form just to dance. Some would

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say it's his last dance. Oh, it hurts. Hi, I'm Chamar Griffith

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and I'm Andrew Tejada. We're going through superhero

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productions to let you know if they're still fun or the hype

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around it was dumb on Cape or cap a Black Nerd superhero

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podcast you

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welcome to this week's installment of Cape or cap, a

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Black Nerd superhero podcast. My name is Chamar Griffith,

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codename comic. Shams and I am Andrew tahata, codename Arete.

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Andrew and I have known each other since 1996 that was the

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year that venom, tooth and claw or and slash, the hunger

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released and in tooth and claw. We had a combination of venom

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and Wolverine across over there, a crossover that thankfully did

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not happen in this year. It was like Deadpool just rolled the

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moose. It's like, No, I have rights to him this year

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tomorrow. Do you even have a universe Sony? But yeah, that's

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yeah. But seriously, I would be terrified if those two had

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crossed over this year. Yeah, yeah. I don't even know that.

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Gosh. I mean, I guess it would be a very mid movie. It would

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balance out, very good. Yeah, you know who would love it?

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Thanos. You're just like, perfectly balanced. Oh, man. But

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speaking of terror, terror, terrifying things, uh, today we

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are covering what we love on this show to do a Calendar Man

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holiday special. Yes, he is back. He is, well, he's not in

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the room with us right now. He unfortunately, has invested in a

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lot of things since our time together on yet another DC

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animated podcast. I believe now he has like 3000 interns. He's

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basically like, mini Google or something, I don't know. Oh

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yeah, he's trying to get Daylight Savings changed. We

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don't really know what the angle is, but that's taking most of

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his time right now. But in honor of our connection with him, and

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he did request this of us, we are doing a Halloween special.

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Now, I know on the recording of this episode, it is after

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Halloween, so we're either late due to his issues of Dayton,

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like savings time, or we're just in time for 2025, Halloween. Who

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knows? Yeah, and you know things are scary enough in the world.

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So this is releasing before the election. So I think it's still

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I think it's still time. It's still scary time. Well, let's

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have some fun scary time, because today we are covering

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the latest Venom movie that is right, Venom three that's

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dropped in theaters in October. We are covering Venom the last

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dance, a runtime of 110 minutes. This 2020, form film received a

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PG 13 rating. Still trying to figure out how PG 13. All right,

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so we got this film was directed by Kelly Marcel. This is her

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directorial debut. Um. Kelly wrote basically the entire film

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series, and today she is actually working with Tom Hardy

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to write out this final film in the venom trilogy. And of

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course, as K pocap standards, we do have the rating score of it

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already according to Rotten Tomatoes, it currently has a 39%

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on Rotten Tomatoes from critics and 80% from the audiences. So

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it's a popcorn fresh or whatever they're calling it now, on

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right? Tomatoes, I don't know. They don't know fruits and

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vegetables over there, all right. So now we got our cast

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list. We got Tom Hardy, who is returning for the third time now

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as Eddie Brock, or actually, fourth time. Yeah, fourth, yeah,

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we were counseling for it because of no way home. Okay,

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great, yeah. Eddie Brock is being played by Tom Hardy, who

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also provides the voice of venom. We got. She would tell

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Oja for you know, when he's not getting sidelined from giving Dr

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Strange the work today he is playing Rex Strickland just

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we'll get into that Juno Temple of Ted lasso fame is here today

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as Dr Teddy Payne, and I will hold on to who this character

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ends up being. Reese iphens, um, is that actually how you

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pronounce his name? I I believe so. Lisa, okay, well, either

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way, we didn't like him in Harry Potter, after what he did as Mr.

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Love go. It. And we probably were a little upset about what

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he did in The Amazing Spider Man, when he kind of unalive

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Captain Stacy, yeah, not a great track record in terms of

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superhero movies, no. But today we'll see what happens when he

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plays Martin Moon, which I will get into because the things that

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happened with this character, and just the name in general,

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and the Spider Man lore kind of really upset me. Uh, Stephen

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Graham returns from the second film where he is once again

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playing Patrick Mulligan. Um, I guess sort of we'll get into

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that. Peggy Lou returns as Mrs. Chan Clark. Bucha makes her

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appearance as Sadie Christmas. I believe she is also a doctor in

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this film. That's not her name, that is 100% her name. Oh, my

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God, at least according to um, Wikipedia, the cast list,

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Reddit, the internet, you're shaking your head. I I'm sorry

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for I mean, look, if anything, this works as a double holiday

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special. We got someone named Christmas in here, I guess so.

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Christmas came early, and finally, he was the director of

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the second film of this trilogy. Today he takes a step into the

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actual on screen actions of the film as Andy Serkis plays the

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character, no, the creator of the symbiotes, certainly, he's

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certainly there, yep, yep, yep, yep, things were filmed with

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him. All right, with that, let's see if this movie bonded with us

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in this capercap review of venom, the last dance. So

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speaking of Andy Serkis, we start out with a hard, cold open

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of we're just on some black, Inky planet. It looks pretty

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scary. Honestly, not gonna lie, crawling with these creatures.

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And a guy No is just saying, hey, basically, I'm the scariest

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of all these creatures. They imprison me in this throne. But

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if I get a codex, we're not sly. We know you stole that from Man

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of Steel. He's like, but if I get a codex, I can get out of

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this chair I'm stuck in and then, presumably, like, destroy

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everything. And apparently the people who rebelled against Him

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were his creations, the symbiotes. So I hope you were

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taking notes, because everything he said is extremely important

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to understanding the nuances of the plot, although they

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explained those nuances 100 times and after the CGI scene,

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we now go back to No way home. Yeah, so if you never saw Spider

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Man, no way home, one. I mean, you may have enjoyed it, but if

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you never saw, well, actually, also the second film within this

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venom series, here's a quick recap. Eddie. At some point, due

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to the events of no way home, thanks to magic, gets teleported

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to the universe of Marvel, universe the MCU, which,

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although spoilers for Deadpool and Wolverine, is marked as

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Earth 616, fans, no, that's not really the case. So let's just

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say, for the all intensities of this particular review, he is on

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earth 616, he finds out everything explains what's going

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on. He finds that there's a joke about how he's trying to explain

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to the bartender that aliens exist, and the bartender says, I

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know because me and my family were booked away thanks to an

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alien, and they're all confused as to why people know aliens

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exist. None of that matters, because Eddie gets teleported

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back to his Earth, where, once again, he beats a variant of the

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same bartender, now in a more rundown version of the same bar,

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and it turns into an extended sequence in which he is drunk,

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causing venom to be drunk, causing venom to do what I guess

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every single person who ever is drunk when they're at home, if a

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bunch of liquor would do and just create as many cocktails as

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they can figure out, while also making the mess of the place. I

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mean, I feel like I've done that once or twice, but I feel like

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the way he was doing it, I would even want to clean that up.

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Yeah, he wrecks. He wrecks the bar, which he thinks is his

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biggest crime, until he sees a television set where he finds

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out that he is being suspected from the murder of Patrick

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Mulligan in the last at the in the last film during the battle

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with carnage. Patrick Mulligan was Fallon was impaled due to

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carnage or shriek one of them. Um, the villains, the villains

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in it. Um, they usually be doing it, yeah, at the end of that

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movie, you from what I recalled, they. Away from the police after

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the carnage battle, yet they're somehow surprised that they're

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being hunted by the police in this movie. I What? How drunk

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Are you guys? You gotta understand that wasn't hungover

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venom, that was pre hung over venom. We don't remember what

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pre hungover does. That's

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true. Um, so as they find us out, what they decide to do is

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leave a coin, a little change for the bartender to pay the

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damages the the coin has a little piece of symbiote on it.

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Um, also, Eddie is like, Hey, I know what I should do to get out

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of this. I have some dirt on a judge in New York. I'm gonna go

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blackmail a judge in New York to get me out of something I did in

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Los Angeles, and I'm gonna get there from Mexico. Airtight

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plan, Eddie, I can't see any flaws whatsoever. But honestly,

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don't even worry about that, because there's gotta be a fight

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scene now, yes, because, well, this leads into villains who are

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not connected to the plot in any way, shape or form. Because

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Eddie, he comes across a place, a location where there's just,

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unfortunately, people who are holding dogs captive in the

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efforts of doing a dog fighting ring, they try and go to save

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the dogs. Unfortunately, at that moment they are, they come face

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to face with the people who are running the whole thing, and it

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turns into an extended fight scene of Eddie using the

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symbiote venom. The two of them are working very well together,

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not in a typical sense where we've seen Venom use either in

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like spider man three, or any other animated iteration of

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venom, or even going to say, in Spider Man two, the Sony video

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game, Eddie uses venom in a way where it's just like he

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basically uses him to push him off surfaces and to enhance his

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strength. So you see a lot of Tom Hardy just having black goo

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around fist or his legs to strengthen his attacks. And he's

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able to do all this to the point where he finally has everybody

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captured. And in a scene from the trailer. I guess it's like a

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joke to show that they're still trying to figure out how to work

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together, despite showing that they've worked very well

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together in this earlier fight that they try to say the classic

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line of we are venom, but tend to go back and forth on the

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pacing, the timing, but that's all pushed to the side, because

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obviously Venom was promised that if he has guessed to fight

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bad guys, he could eat their heads. And that is basically

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what he does. Yep, and he frees all the dogs that were captured.

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And in the distance we see an alien following him, one of the

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aliens from Noel's planet, who was promised that they would be

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allowed to live if they retrieved the codex that Eddie

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Brock has apparently put a pin on that because that's going to

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be important to rant about later. So hard cut again. This

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movie loves its hard cuts. I don't know what the editor was

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thinking. Just be as jarring as possible. I think I'm just gonna

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assume, because there's like, 15,000 plot points in this film.

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Yeah, it's like, why even hide it? We cut to a dream of a young

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brother and sister on a beach talking about whatever. It

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doesn't matter, but what matters is that there's lightning on

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this beach. It's like the worst nighttime beach lightning storm

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I've ever seen. Yeah, no, working. This is dangerous. Like

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this is, this is like watching man made global warming.

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Something like this is why I imagine it would look like,

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yeah. Um, so the lightning strikes the brother and sister.

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The brother dies, but the sister survives with a an electric

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scar. We suddenly, she wakes up, and it's revealed she is a

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scientist, um, who is working at Area 51 there's just no easy way

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to transition from that, but not really, because she's really

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working at Area 55 the place underneath area 51 and they're

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decommissioning area 51 for some reason. And she works there

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because her brother really wanted to study aliens. And so

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she's like, since he's dead, I guess I'll just do his thing and

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not do anything independent, also in a massive Mass. Of OSHA

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violation. There's an at Area 51 there is a just a vat of acid

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that just gets poured on anything they want to dispose

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of, just in the open, no walls, no cages, no gates. You just

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dump acid right like where anybody no barrier, no. There

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wasn't even a warning when it goes on. Oh, my God, yes. Oh,

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wow. Um, I never realized that, you know, I did think it was

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weird that this, that they, they were one, using acid to just

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break down all these, like, large items just out again, out

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in the open. Everybody could see, I know that, like that

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whole raid on area 51 this that we were planning at some point

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back in the past, I feel like this would have been the time,

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would have been profitable for people. He may have gotten

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burns, but, um, but at the same time as we're seeing all this,

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this is when we see, um, Barry Mordo, I mean, the Rex

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Strickland popped through. He's running this team that basically

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supposed to, supposed to keep the aliens from being seen by

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the people and destroying all their technology. But not quite

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like MIB, because they apparently kill on site. So I

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guess this is like a branch off of the men in black that just

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was more like, I guess like the LAPD version of it. I digress.

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Um, but we hear that they are also on the look for Eddie. They

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he gets this order to go look for some from the shadowy

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figure. And they immediately start to chase where Evie is

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just basically being followed, Scene after scene by soldiers

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who are attacking him at various points. Meanwhile, we also see

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that, um, he's as he's trying to do this journey to New York.

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Eddie is like, now trying to he's talking with venom, and

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you're like, you know, my life was so much different just about

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a year ago, which shocked me, because I was just like, Eddie's

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looking kind of rough in this like, I'm surprised. This was

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only a year, yeah, this has been a long year for you, bro, man,

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like he did a bit in Atlanta, but this entire time, it

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definitely does set the stage of this being light. The two of

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them are reaching what can be their final moments together,

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because they're trying to figure out what this life look like for

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them for the rest of time. They know that they're bonded

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together. They know that they've had to sacrifice a lot, and

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unfortunately, they're in a situation where they're even

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worse off. So now that Eddie is trying to get back, he decides

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he sees now at least, he tried to figure out, how can he maybe

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even, like, fly over to New York. Unfortunately, he does get

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attacked by Strickland's guys, as they basically, I guess at

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one point have an intense Walker fight that also leads to Eddie

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swimming with them. Yes. So this is another editing thing. So

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right before this fight, I just want to, just have to this is

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like, we have a brief interaction with Strickland, who

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is, um, talking to the scientists. He gets mad at one

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scientist for having a Christmas pin that her dead mother gave

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her. I He's like, it's not Christmas. He's like, Yeah, I

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know my mom gave this to me, Jesus Christ guy, um, I want to

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see his anti Christmas movie, um, but he talks with toxin,

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who, apparently, is the guy who, oh yeah, Patrick Mulligan, who

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the guy who was supposed to be killed in last movie didn't die.

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They had him a life support. They gave him a symbiote. All of

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this would have been really interesting to see happen

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instead of being expositioned. Also, I'm really mad, because

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technically, this isn't toxin. Oh God, this is not even the

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backstory of toxins. Well, you know what? I'm not that

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surprised. You have all the rights to do it. Why not just

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make it so gotta ask Sony um toxin tells them basically,

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because at a point, there was a point where Venom revived Eddie,

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when Eddie was dead, that that created a codex that the Codex

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could free. No Sure, and so as soon as he finds this out, the

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general Strickland's like, I gotta go get him immediate cut

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to him doing that. Like, what? What was the time? How much time

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passed between that conversation and him having the water fight?

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I.

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And in the water fight the venom and this and Eddie get

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temporarily desponded, leading Eddie to have to fight a soldier

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and kill a soldier with his bare hands. And after this, after

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this, Bailey survived this fight due to intervention from the

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xenophage chasing them, and he is really devastated, because

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during that fight, he lost his shoes.

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It also adds some insight to it. Um, this was a running gag, I

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would assume, because, yeah, the shoes he lost were cowboy boots

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that he stole from the dog fighting ring because one of the

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dogs started chewing up his Crocs and Venom suggested he

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wear the cowboy boots. So now, once again, Eddie has lost his

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shoes, but fortunately, he relies on the kindness of

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strangers during this existential crisis he goes

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through where he meets the moon family, a family of alien

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Loving, I guess, very relaxed individuals, I would say a

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father, mother and two kids who are on their way to area 51

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after learning that the whole place was going to be

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decommissioned, their hopes and dreams is to go there and find

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an alien and see one in real life. And Eddie, obviously. I

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don't know why he but I'm assuming just because it's he

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wants to keep a secret identity and whatnot, doesn't share that

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he actually has an alien with him. Um, he says he even

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believe, says that. Like he doesn't believe, he believes in

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aliens, but he doesn't really think they're real, trying to,

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like, throw them off the scent of him or anything. I also

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assumed it was like an attempt to make sure that he didn't get

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caught by the police. But I'm just like my guy, these people

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have been in living in a camper for the last, probably what

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looks like 50 years. I think you're fine. So as they're

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driving along, um, Venom is having this like one there's a

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musical break now, yes, fortunately, though it's not. Is

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not as much as Joker two, but we do have this internal monolog,

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or dialog between Eddie and Venom, where venom is like, you

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know, Eddie, you could have had something like this. I really

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wish that we had something like this. And he just wishes that

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Eddie could have had a better opportunity recognizing, I

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guess, how much he has caused Eddie's life to change since

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this entire bonding experience that they had, since the first

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movie, yeah, and it is a moment of, you know, really, you know,

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well written self reflection. Don't know what movie it's

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supposed to be in, because it doesn't fit this movie at all.

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So they're on the trip, and they eventually get to Vegas, and

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there's a very extended bit where Eddie tries to walk in

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with his dirty clothes, but he can't, so a guy pees on his

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feet, and he has to take the guy who pees on his feet suit. It's

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just, just things don't have to happen. Sometimes there are some

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scenes you don't need to show, um, you know, in every movie,

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and this is all of them. Um, so he goes into the machine the

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casino conveniently runs into his neighbor slash friend, Miss

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chan elsewhere, Strickland, having so devastated after

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losing all those soldiers in the alien versus alien battle, gets

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authorization From a shadowy person whose identity we never

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discover he gets, he's like, Strickland, like, Can I use the

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six? And they're like, yes, you have alteration for the six. Now

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I'm thinking, in my naive mind, this might be a Sinister Six

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thing. Maybe they're going to pull together some of, maybe for

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real vulture, Morbius, you know, I don't know. So we're going to,

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we're going to put in a pin in that because Eddie goes back to

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Mrs. Chen's room because she's been winning a lot, and she

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demands a dance with venom. It is established, the only way

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venom can be seen by his alien enemy is if he turns into Venom

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form. So he turns into Venom form just to dance. Some would

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say it's his last dance. Oh, it hurts that. Oh, gosh. I need to

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talk to everyone who. Is involved in the naming of this.

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If that is the case, should be banned from cinema for at least

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25 days after that. Obviously, because he's in Veno form, he

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immediately, I gotta say this, this creature, I think, is

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called the xenophage, or something like that. It's a

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pretty interesting creature, mainly because it's a giant,

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like praying mantis with like a tree chipper in its mouth. So

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every single time they're able to take any one of his victims,

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it will take it, bring it to his mouth, and it will just spray

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out the back. So it's intimidating. It's a very

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intimidating creature. I'll give it that. The most intimidating

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thing about it is because Venom's Codex is Brian's, sorry,

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Venom's Codex shines so brightly as soon as he goes on. It could

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be like 50, 130,000 miles away. I don't know how big the Earth

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is, but it will always go and be able to find it somehow arrive

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two seconds later, even though it does not have the power of

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flight, teleportation or super speed, and also it immediately

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stops when Venom gets out of his venom, full Venom form, right?

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But it's like, if it just went the direction it lost, it

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probably would have gotten there. Could just stop suddenly,

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and it pisses me off, yeah, but right before the Xena phage can

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reach venom, during the dance where someone had to animate the

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CGI toes, I'm so sorry. Um, all of a sudden the six show up. And

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you know who the six are, regular goddamn guys, because

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this movie doesn't know how to have fun. Oh, my God, this

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pissed me off so much. Because, well, I mean, they did it in the

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first movie, and we'll get to this. But it is kind of shown.

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But there's a point in venom, lethal protector, the comic in

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which venom has five symbiotes that he has to fight off

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against. It's one more number. We could have done something

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here. So now that venom, or Eddie Brock, has to fight off

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against the six regular soldiers. They do get the upper

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hand. They are able to split venom from Eddie, which causes

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the xenophage to not attack everybody for some reason,

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instead, just runs away. They take Benham and Eddie into the

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facility where Eddie now comes face to face with Patrick

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Mulligan or not, toxin, I'm not going to give him the credit and

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call toxin, because I did like toxin when I was a kid, because

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I thought was, like a cool idea. My inner child will be very

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upset right now, so they talk about what happened, and they're

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like, We gotta get out of here, because he's coming. No, be

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here. You gotta make sure that, no, doesn't get the codex that

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will free him. And all this is happening while, once again,

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Strickland is just very dismissive towards the both of

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the doctors. Doctors, Chris, I think it is Christmas. I mean,

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yeah, the internet said it, I'm I forgot about the pin, but I'll

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be like, I'll be tight if they just gave her a random name

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because of a pin. Um, but Chris? Dr, Christmas and Dr, Temple, so

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at one random moment after being berated by Strickland, dr,

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Christmas just goes to a random person in the room and ask about

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family, and I'm still don't get what, why the question was made,

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because we had no understanding of who her character was. In the

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entirety of this film, she was definitely treated as just like

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a second in command to Dr temple who was getting crazy filmed

Unknown:

backstory, but with no context. And if you thought Dr temple

Unknown:

didn't have any context, needed to Dr Christmas. So ultimately,

Unknown:

she follows along to where the Venom symbiote is being taken

Unknown:

down because it's revealed that they have six other Venom

Unknown:

symbiotes in the facility. She follows down there and then,

Unknown:

unfortunately, they are all attacked by a xenophage. And in

Unknown:

order to help out, she somehow gets a Venom Symbiote on her,

Unknown:

turning into she venoms. And second appearance of she venom

Unknown:

in a live action production to help free Eddie, who

Unknown:

unfortunately takes a bullet during the firefight, and

Unknown:

thankfully, though, with venom back in play, is able to get the

Unknown:

bullet out of Betty, helping him to recuperate, yeah,

Unknown:

um, this is where the movie, okay, I'll admit it started to

Unknown:

look a little fun here because, um, I'm not going to spend too

Unknown:

much time on this, because the movie didn't care to do this

Unknown:

enough. But the family and the alien. Family from before they

Unknown:

arrive in the facility, break into area 51 they make a joke

Unknown:

about child services. Should take the kids away, and

Unknown:

honestly, yes, yes, they should be separated from these from

Unknown:

parents who break into area 51 with the large acid pit. Um. So

Unknown:

the family arrives, and at the same time the xenophage does so

Unknown:

they get their wish. They get to see an alien and realize it's

Unknown:

horrible inside. In the chaos of the xenophage arriving,

Unknown:

xenophage takes out a bunch of people, including Jim who Sadie

Unknown:

Christmas screams, tavare lungs, who's had like one scene prior

Unknown:

to this moment, but it's so played as this emotional moment.

Unknown:

But luckily, Jim is brought back to life when a symbiote bonds

Unknown:

with him, and we have other we get a total of six symbiotes

Unknown:

running around that a bonded with scientists that I guess

Unknown:

they were close to even on the first movie. It was a real point

Unknown:

that symbiotes just can't bond with anybody. Forget about that,

Unknown:

Joe. Forget about it. The whole movie. What's about that?

Unknown:

Meanwhile, Yo, you want to send me yo, yo. We got you. We got

Unknown:

you. Everybody gets a symbiote like we on Oprah, Marvel or

Unknown:

something. It was wild and including a symbiote who, like

Unknown:

fused with another symbiote. So it could be a two headed

Unknown:

symbiote. I want that movie. I'm sorry I'm doing it early my RT

Unknown:

alterations. I want the love story of these two symbiotes

Unknown:

who, as soon as they found human host, fused into one body,

Unknown:

Steven Universe style, yes, cement their love only to be

Unknown:

savagely and cruelly killed after being ripped apart by

Unknown:

xenophage. That happens we're there's no point in discussing

Unknown:

it. Oh, they, most of them, die. Jim. Oh, man, I love Jim, the

Unknown:

fire symbiote with the fire lash. I want to see that movie

Unknown:

too. That's my second RT alteration. What's that deal?

Unknown:

Let me just follow that. Can we just get a venom for like, I'm

Unknown:

fine if it's not Tom Hardy, but we need either a venom four or,

Unknown:

you know, I will say we're probably getting a little

Unknown:

exhausted from so many television series that give like

Unknown:

one episode, perm Symbio. But I want to see them come back like

Unknown:

you have just loose Symbios out there who are just doing their

Unknown:

own thing, and they have amazing abilities, more so that we saw

Unknown:

with venom, like in the first movie, he faced off someone who

Unknown:

was basically like him in the second movie. What was the Oh

Unknown:

yeah, Carnage. Question mark, his son, right, right? You saw

Unknown:

how Venom decided he was going to be an absentee father. But

Unknown:

besides the point, we want to see the movie where it's like,

Unknown:

if you're going to expand the universe of venom, especially

Unknown:

with the universe of symbiotes, especially when you have, I'm

Unknown:

assuming, all the rights, because you're using a lot of

Unknown:

the characters, and have enough of them to create the actual

Unknown:

comic book story that's connected with them. You know,

Unknown:

it probably will look a lot like Captain America Civil War,

Unknown:

where, you know, it was supposed to be a battle of superheroes,

Unknown:

and you just got five guys and his friends is beating up

Unknown:

beating up each other in a large airport. But we would have

Unknown:

appreciated that if you just gave us the opportunity to see

Unknown:

symbiotes in action and in action you do before they're all

Unknown:

killed, except for she vet him and Venom himself. And they try

Unknown:

a bunch of things, but ultimately, the xenophobes keep

Unknown:

regenerating. Funny that these regenerating creatures are so

Unknown:

concerned about null killing them, because they seemingly can

Unknown:

regenerate from any injury. So don't know what this this was

Unknown:

scared or No, he's in a chair. So at this point, they realize

Unknown:

venom and Eddie realize there's really nothing they can do. And

Unknown:

a bunch of more xenophages show up, and they're going to keep

Unknown:

coming. And we know one of them has to die. At least one of them

Unknown:

has to die to get rid of this Codex. So venom and Eddie agree

Unknown:

to go in together. They draw in all the xenopages by expanding

Unknown:

their body, and they start dragging their body to the acid

Unknown:

pit. And at this point, when they get to the acid pit, Venom

Unknown:

pulls an ejectocedo Cuz on Eddie and launches Eddie a wave into

Unknown:

safety, although there's any safe zone near a pile of acid,

Unknown:

as proven by Strickland, who he was stabbed in the middle of

Unknown:

this, it doesn't matter. They didn't gave him no backstory or

Unknown:

character. I'm sorry, but since the acid pit does require a

Unknown:

finger pit and Iris, you. I read to turn on Strickland turns it

Unknown:

on while getting horribly burnt by the acid. But I do think the

Unknown:

look of his face while he was getting burnt by the acid was

Unknown:

probably the look on Chiwetel face when he read the script and

Unknown:

realized this was it. And yeah, and acid does its thing. And

Unknown:

yep. And that's, that's it, bye, Venom, yeah, I will say there's

Unknown:

a little was a little touching scene where it was a little

Unknown:

touching for me when Venom decides to shoot Eddie out to

Unknown:

protect him and just take on all the xenophosis to burn them by

Unknown:

acid, which I don't know how he figured that would work. They

Unknown:

hadn't seen the pit. They weren't always there. They

Unknown:

wouldn't know it was there. I did think it was a little

Unknown:

touchy. Sorry. I could have keep a straight face on here, because

Unknown:

the plot said so this is why they would have just figured out

Unknown:

that it was a vat of acid. It's somewhere in the facility. I do

Unknown:

have an actual alteration later about that, but we'll get to it

Unknown:

later. But I did think it was a little touching when Venom upon

Unknown:

saving Eddie and telling him to go live his life, he takes like

Unknown:

you think he's going to try to re bond with them so that Eddie

Unknown:

could, like, pull him back out. But no, he instead grabs a lead

Unknown:

door. I'm assuming it was lead. I don't know what material is

Unknown:

unable to stop acid from getting burned, getting getting burned

Unknown:

by acid, but he uses it to cover Eddie in very calm way, like he

Unknown:

tucks away a little kid telling them a bedtime story. And I can

Unknown:

look speaking of faces, Tom Hardy's face on that to me, it

Unknown:

was just like, why are we even doing this? So after the acid

Unknown:

sprays everywhere, Eddie wakes up. He tries to Eddie wakes up,

Unknown:

tries to talk to venom, but nobody answers. Our random

Unknown:

general, just a random joke. Oh, no, no, we missed some random

Unknown:

poignant scene for character closure or development for Dr

Unknown:

temple. Oh, sorry. How could I forget? Because she was struck

Unknown:

by lightning, yeah, in the middle of this, Dr Temple is

Unknown:

running away with Christmas, and they're about to die in the acid

Unknown:

explosion, and she, you activates the symbiote that

Unknown:

gives her, like lightning powers, and she can run real

Unknown:

fast, like The Flash. And it's late. It's late. She also has

Unknown:

cool, long hair. She'll give her that. Okay, yeah, but it's it's

Unknown:

late. It's too late. That should have happened 1015, minutes ago.

Unknown:

Yeah,

Unknown:

it's it just, it's so great, um, but, and she doesn't come back

Unknown:

before the end of the movie. Um, that's it. That's the last you

Unknown:

see of her. So good luck with that. Um, also sorry, but Jim

Unknown:

was mortally wounded right in that the battle scene. And

Unknown:

doesn't the Codex get created when somebody who's morally

Unknown:

wounded is brought back to life by venom. Yep, did Jim have a

Unknown:

codex? We'll get into that anyway. Eddie wakes up. A random

Unknown:

general tells them, hey, guess what, your crimes are expunged.

Unknown:

Don't tell anybody about this, and we're all good. Eddie

Unknown:

returns to New York City, sees the Statue of Liberty, and

Unknown:

there's a montage to memories. Bring back memories, bring back

Unknown:

the previous movies a little bit, but mainly this movie a

Unknown:

flashback,

Unknown:

you know, sorry, but deadpool three already had a better and

Unknown:

more emotional montage. I'm sorry, guys, you came in too

Unknown:

late for that one. Yeah, yeah. And with that, like any 2000s

Unknown:

early 2000s film set in New York, we closed out to a panning

Unknown:

out shot of the Statue of Liberty, done at a very fast

Unknown:

pace, leading us to our credits, where we see various animals who

Unknown:

have been venom. Five they, I don't think half of them

Unknown:

actually appeared in our film here, but it was just cool to

Unknown:

see kind of like artwork. And of course, we get our post credit

Unknown:

scene. Um, so we did see earlier in the movie that with the

Unknown:

destruction of the Codex, that was with venom, um, he null

Unknown:

seems to be like, sent further away somewhere like he just, I

Unknown:

don't know something happened. He's just in anguish, and it

Unknown:

seemed like he was teleported away. Our post credit scene,

Unknown:

though, does show that no is alive and well. We get a better

Unknown:

look at his face. It's a lot like the the Dark Elves from

Unknown:

Thor Dark World. I'm sorry to bring up that movie, and he's

Unknown:

saying that, you know. Know that he is gonna make his comeback. I

Unknown:

I don't know how, because, I mean, based off of just inside

Unknown:

universes, I don't know there's other ways, but also outside of

Unknown:

your universe, according to the laws of like, what legal rights

Unknown:

Sony has versus what legal rights Marvel has it. We're

Unknown:

still in the we're still in the bubble. And then we also get

Unknown:

another final post credit scene where we did see earlier that

Unknown:

the I am unfortunately forgetting his name, and I did

Unknown:

not grab it for this episode, but he is famous from Ted lasso

Unknown:

as well, where he loves football. He was our bartender.

Unknown:

He was taken into custody after Venom left his bar, he was taken

Unknown:

in by Strickland. He somehow survives the entire explosion of

Unknown:

area 51 and area 55 along with the attacks from the xenophase.

Unknown:

So he's walking out confused all while we see the random little

Unknown:

piece of venom that was left behind and taken in by

Unknown:

Strickland. The container it was in has cracked, and we see a

Unknown:

little black bug making its way out, hinting at the possibility

Unknown:

that venom may actually still be around in some capacity. Yep,

Unknown:

that's it. You know, I'm actually kind of mad that they

Unknown:

did memories and not not last dance. Like, no last dance.

Unknown:

Like, we need somebody to pick songs and movies better. Yeah.

Unknown:

James Gunn can't be the only one. Like, come on. Like, you

Unknown:

can't. You got to have a proper DJ at any given party this year.

Unknown:

This this year in superhero movies, lately, sorely has hated

Unknown:

ones. All right, so obviously, because we have gone through

Unknown:

this, and we probably have already hinted from the way that

Unknown:

we have talked about this, it is now time for our official

Unknown:

rating. Andrew, for you, if you had to, now that you have given

Unknown:

this movie the full rundown. Is this movie a cape, or has it

Unknown:

somehow turned into a venomous cap? Give it the biggest

Unknown:

venomous cap you have. My goodness gracious, the last two

Unknown:

movies in this in this franchise, were not great, but I

Unknown:

had fun, and it seemed like everyone was trying to do

Unknown:

something very specific venom. One it was to, you know, really

Unknown:

change the tone of venom. And I retrospect, I can appreciate

Unknown:

what they're trying to do there into carnage, was the main

Unknown:

person. And they really leaned into carnage, their specific

Unknown:

version of carnage, versus this goofy Venom really kind of

Unknown:

worked somehow. But here there is just nothing. There is

Unknown:

nothing. There's no synergy between the goofy venom and

Unknown:

these really boring, flat scientist characters, Joe what's

Unknown:

given nothing to do here, and that is a shame for an actor of

Unknown:

his caliber. Juno Temple and Sadie Christmas are given we

Unknown:

only learn through them do exposition and the odd line, but

Unknown:

truly, I just don't know what their ultimate goal was. Of all

Unknown:

this. I mean, Juno Temple's character says at one point

Unknown:

that, you know, she wanted to follow her brother's footsteps,

Unknown:

and I get it. You did it. What now? What do you want to do? I

Unknown:

don't, I don't have the answers to those questions. And no, sits

Unknown:

in a chair. The main villain sits in a chair. We're following

Unknown:

goons the whole time, combined with really questionable editing

Unknown:

and just a lot of the fight scenes are really quick. They're

Unknown:

really, really quick. Um, the plane fight scene was maybe less

Unknown:

than 30 seconds. I don't know what was going on. Also, did

Unknown:

that plane crash? Because the xenophage definitely went it

Unknown:

should have, it should have, not that we one wanted that to see

Unknown:

one of them. We wanted to see that at all. But the alien

Unknown:

turned out tore up the turbine of that plane. I don't think the

Unknown:

plane is going to make it. I'm sorry. So there is, I mean, I

Unknown:

don't know if the movie was chopped up, if there was

Unknown:

intentions. I don't know what happened here, but I'll give I

Unknown:

mean, there's really nothing, no one quick fix, but I'm just

Unknown:

gonna drop an RT alteration that I can't believe even in this

Unknown:

movie, they didn't pull out the entire time the US government is

Unknown:

following Eddie. They have video camera. They see he engage with

Unknown:

the family. Why didn't the government just capture the

Unknown:

family? Bring them to area 51 because there's a scene with the

Unknown:

fam where Venom saves the family at Area Oh, yeah. And then Eddie

Unknown:

and. Venom are motivated to go and sink in to break them out.

Unknown:

On their way in, they see the acid pit. They see the pile of

Unknown:

explosives, and it would make sense why they get captured in

Unknown:

the facility where they have home field advantage instead of

Unknown:

six regular ass guys. So that's that's the one thing I can't

Unknown:

believe didn't do it. Would not fix this movie by any means. It

Unknown:

would not make it weird, less weird that the lizard is running

Unknown:

around as a hippie in the Spider Man universe. But, man, this

Unknown:

movie needed something, and it just didn't have it. What do

Unknown:

you? What about you? What do you? What do you think about

Unknown:

this thing? Oh,

Unknown:

man. Like, I couldn't agree more. This whole thing is a

Unknown:

straight up cat for me. Like I have look i There were times in

Unknown:

which, like, I did enjoy seeing the unique fighting style that

Unknown:

Eddie had with venom. And, you know, maybe some lines work. A

Unknown:

lot of lines, unfortunately, did it. But the main issue that I

Unknown:

have with this entire movie is that it basically overhyped the

Unknown:

conflict and it failed to deliver on it. We have no who is

Unknown:

sharing his deep, deep connection as the like the

Unknown:

creator of the symbiotes, and he is warning that he actually is

Unknown:

on his way, like we've had two movies and seeing how symbiotes

Unknown:

have been such a dangerous threat to the planet in their

Unknown:

own various ways, not knowing that it was actually no who

Unknown:

probably could have been pulling the strings this entire time.

Unknown:

And then have it be like, Oh, well, no. Actually sent these

Unknown:

things down and they're he's actually against them. So it's

Unknown:

just like, Okay, great. We have the symbiotes who have caused

Unknown:

chaos, but then you have something that was already, that

Unknown:

already hated them, and then he's even a bigger threat, and

Unknown:

he just sits in the chair the entire time. You're right. He

Unknown:

were just like dealing with goons. He just serves as the

Unknown:

boogeyman, like even in Ant Man In The Wasp quantum mania, you

Unknown:

had the boogeyman of Kang giving Ant Man the work Paul Rudd took

Unknown:

hits to the face. You mean to tell me that Tom Hardy couldn't

Unknown:

take one from Noel at any point during this movie was supposed

Unknown:

to be his last movie as Venom. And the other issues I saw was

Unknown:

that, you know, we usually in cases like this, I would love to

Unknown:

just like, overlook that. Like, you know, hey, like, you are

Unknown:

setting up for a bigger story. You're setting up for a bigger

Unknown:

adventure, like we dealt with Thanos, having to spend, like,

Unknown:

almost half a half a decade for his build up before we finally

Unknown:

saw him in action. And I would have been fine if that was like

Unknown:

we had that build up, but then the rest of the story was great.

Unknown:

The entire movie only, there's only one returning character,

Unknown:

and that's the main character. This is the last film you can

Unknown:

bring anybody else back from the last two movies, except for

Unknown:

Patrick Mulligan, who completely changes the dynamic and the

Unknown:

demeanor of the character he previously played. So that, and

Unknown:

then to have it be that you're introducing characters like Dr

Unknown:

Payne and Dr Christmas, I also agree like it just felt like

Unknown:

they're thrown at us and given to us as if they are people who

Unknown:

we should have known this entire time, but now you're spending

Unknown:

every other five seconds trying to make sure, make it look like

Unknown:

they actually matter to us and actually make she care? Like,

Unknown:

honestly, take out all the stuff with, like, the reason why they

Unknown:

showing the whole scene of her getting electrocuted and the

Unknown:

death of her brother, don't include that line from Dr

Unknown:

Christmas about the sense of family for not going to build on

Unknown:

that entirely in some way, shape or form. Like, it just feels

Unknown:

like they were given some really big, poignant things, but they

Unknown:

never actually dive deep onto them. So now they just feel

Unknown:

like, Oh, you're just here to bond with symbiotes, and that's

Unknown:

it to make cool looking symbiotes, which, granted, these

Unknown:

are symbiotes from comics, but they're also not the individuals

Unknown:

who were bonded with these symbiotes to even begin with.

Unknown:

These are brand new creations, so that's why I'm upset about

Unknown:

that. Also the moons, look, I don't know why they were really

Unknown:

in there, so I don't really have notes about them, yeah, because

Unknown:

I don't have the bandwidth or willpower to write out, because

Unknown:

this movie definitely didn't. But the one thing I am upset

Unknown:

about with that is that you can't use the last name moon in

Unknown:

Sony's Spider Man universe and not connected to Cindy Moon, who

Unknown:

is silk, who, honestly, in my opinion, should have been a

Unknown:

bigger character than Spider Gwen. I say it as is because it

Unknown:

was an original character. It was a character who had a

Unknown:

connection to Peter Parker, not in the alternate reality

Unknown:

universe, in the main universe. And unfortunately, this is just

Unknown:

one of the many times that her Cindy Moon character gets

Unknown:

failed. And I don't know if the intention was to. That like this

Unknown:

kid, the oldest daughter was supposed to be Cindy, because

Unknown:

they definitely didn't call her that. I think maybe it was. But

Unknown:

then the receipts from Madame Webb came back and they were

Unknown:

like, Let's not do that. So just go with this last movie. Who

Unknown:

even cares? I'm also in the middle of it. I were you where

Unknown:

you were saying, because 100% right, that all across the

Unknown:

board, there's no recurring characters. So it really makes

Unknown:

it jarring what Eddie is fighting against. So if you're

Unknown:

gonna do new characters, another alteration I'd make, have no

Unknown:

possessed Strickland, and the whole time when it would make

Unknown:

sense later on, when it's like, why do you why does he hate

Unknown:

Christmas? Randomly? It's actually because it's null. He

Unknown:

does not care about human holidays. All he wants is to

Unknown:

capture venom. And if that would have been revealed at the end

Unknown:

that Strickland and no were fighting for control, and

Unknown:

Strickland ultimately it's like turning off the acid,

Unknown:

sacrificing himself at the same time. Venom is you might have

Unknown:

had, you might have had been cooking with a little bit more

Unknown:

gas, you know, and then I wouldn't have been as pissed

Unknown:

that the six were regular guys. No, I'm still going to be upset

Unknown:

about that, um, but it just, it just feels like the first two

Unknown:

for other flaws, had creativeness, had flair, and I

Unknown:

don't know where it went, yeah, don't know where it went for the

Unknown:

third one, yeah. Ultimately, this movie just earned the first

Unknown:

half of Venom's monker, because it was lethal. Watching this,

Unknown:

being so excited for a proper you know, not saying great

Unknown:

trilogy, but enough that will make us know that like hey, you

Unknown:

have gotten your accolades for the work you did. Yep. So for

Unknown:

now, Guardians still reigns is the best superhero live action

Unknown:

trilogy. Don't at me, it's true. But before we hop into the comic

Unknown:

book section and why, I don't know why this movie didn't an

Unknown:

explanation of why this movie didn't use most of the lore that

Unknown:

is associated with it, anything we should be mindful of, of

Unknown:

something behind the scenes that was that could have affected why

Unknown:

we saw what we saw. Yeah, the it's still very sparse, because

Unknown:

the movie just came out. But I can give you three quick things.

Unknown:

One, Andy Serkis was the director of the second movie.

Unknown:

People were curious why he couldn't return. He's actually

Unknown:

directing Animal Farm, an interpretation of Animal Farm,

Unknown:

something you probably read in, you know, school. Oh, I read and

Unknown:

watched that movie. Yeah, he's doing a new one, so he didn't

Unknown:

have time to do both. That's why he didn't return a banger. I'm

Unknown:

gonna be so upset this movie to be like 15,000 Academy Award

Unknown:

winning nominations or something, please. And Kelly

Unknown:

Marcel, who has directed TV, but never a full length film, but

Unknown:

had a hand in writing. Every Venom movie stepped up, and I

Unknown:

don't really want to put this all on her, because the edit of

Unknown:

this movie is truly terrible. But I don't know what the

Unknown:

thought was behind putting a first time director to helm the

Unknown:

end of a trilogy, not really sure what the thought was.

Unknown:

Deadline. Hollywood said that some of the underperformance of

Unknown:

the movie could be blamed on the World Series, game between the

Unknown:

Yankees and the Dodgers, which I think is a cap in itself and in

Unknown:

about three weeks, you'll be able to see this on Netflix,

Unknown:

because I think that's how long it's going to last in theaters.

Unknown:

Also, as a Yankees fan, listen, we already hurt and don't put

Unknown:

Venom on us. Yeah, that's rude. Oh, man, all right. Well, I mean

Unknown:

choices were made. I'm glad to see that we hear, really, that

Unknown:

there's a reason behind some of the stuff. I'm wishing Andy

Unknown:

circus the best with this animal farm movie. I'm hoping that

Unknown:

Kelly Marcel does not take the the the unfortunate reviews that

Unknown:

she's that this movie is receiving as any insight onto

Unknown:

her work. Because obviously you were already knocking out the

Unknown:

park as the writer for these films. You were enjoying, we

Unknown:

were enjoying that you were creating wonderful content. And

Unknown:

you know, we understand especially that, like one person

Unknown:

could put together work, but unfortunately, many other people

Unknown:

have input who will force that opinion on on the process and

Unknown:

everything so and again. Do not blame the Yankees for what

Unknown:

happened to venom. We are still hurting. That's I'm I'm gonna

Unknown:

write a strong letter to ever try to combine that because

Unknown:

world, the World Series, yes. All happened in the same

Unknown:

weekend. Those only happened at night. Okay? You had the better

Unknown:

part of the day to go see this movie and the help of his

Unknown:

performance, yeah, if you didn't want to see it, yeah, you didn't

Unknown:

want to see it. And also, studios don't blame superhero

Unknown:

fatigue. This movie is just bad. Okay, stop stop it. Stop it all

Unknown:

right, yeah, yeah, if you want to blame superhero fatigue on

Unknown:

anything, and probably would have been Joaquin Phoenix,

Unknown:

because he was probably just tired the superhero stuff, and

Unknown:

that's why he gave a poor performance.

Unknown:

But speaking of superhero fatigue, obviously, we have to

Unknown:

hop on over to the inspiration for all this stuff, and that is

Unknown:

the comic section of today, which I am going to be calling

Unknown:

null and void. Um, which is what Andy circus is presence as Noel

Unknown:

was in Tyre film. All right, so I will admit that this movie

Unknown:

does take a lot from the venom lore. Um, obviously we have

Unknown:

venom, obviously we have symbiotes, as well as the

Unknown:

introduction of Noel, who has been in comics now for the

Unknown:

better part of the last six years. Officially, though,

Unknown:

Marvel does did seem to be trying to build stuff on the

Unknown:

back end to help bring him into the scene, but he officially

Unknown:

came out in 2018 but before I talk about No, I do want to

Unknown:

point out some of the stuff and some of the big changes and some

Unknown:

of the easter eggs that might have come up in this film. As I

Unknown:

mentioned, Patrick Mulligan is we is taken over by symbiote.

Unknown:

It's not this ghost, like figure that we saw in the film. It

Unknown:

actually just looks like a melted version of carnage, and

Unknown:

that is because it is the son of carnage by the name of toxin,

Unknown:

and obviously, and the other thing too, because every

Unknown:

symbiote since venom has had or carnage has had daddy issues,

Unknown:

toxin hated his father, so he decided to team up with his

Unknown:

grandfather, venom to finally Take down carnage. And in the

Unknown:

comic as well, Patrick Bogan is a cop who unfortunately passes

Unknown:

in the line of duty. And when POM bonding with the symbiote,

Unknown:

the two of them become a, I guess, like lethal deputize

Unknown:

protector, which I would have been cool, yeah. I mean, just,

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you're kind of wasting people behind the scenes here these

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cages is saying, next up, dr, Teddy Payne, there is another

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character in Marvel history that does not have any connection to

Unknown:

Venom whatsoever, and that person goes by Thaddeus Payne.

Unknown:

So this is a brand new creation, I'm assuming, but the symbiote

Unknown:

that she uses is not new. This is the symbiote that goes by the

Unknown:

name of agony. And as far as I could tell, though, the super

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speed is new. Everything dealing with the electrical powers all

Unknown:

brand new. In fact, the name she was first introduced in venom,

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lethal protector back in 1993 however, she didn't get the name

Unknown:

of agony, until much later, when she was a part of a strike team

Unknown:

that consisted about five to six symbiotes. Wait, that's that is

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how like six guys. It sounds like six aliens. Yes, it was

Unknown:

six, six soldiers who actually got symbiotes placed on though

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this is too You're going too fast. I just can't hear guys,

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six guys. That's it. Also speaking of Doctor Payne. We

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also had Sadie Christmas, who did become she Venom for a bit.

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So we do get a chance to see that reappearance since the

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first film, which is also in the comics. But more importantly,

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she bonds with two symbiotes during our film today. The

Unknown:

second one happens to be Lasher, a green symbiote who has knife

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pointed tendrils that come out. And we got a chance to see that

Unknown:

in action. Definitely more lines in this movie that feel that

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Lasher has ever gotten any comic book story. Other appearances

Unknown:

that we did see were phage I believe this was the character

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Jim. He got the phage symbiote, which is another popular one

Unknown:

amongst symbiote fans, and a hint of hybrid, which was when

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the all the five symbiotes, the children of venom that were

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released in the comic venom, lethal protector by David

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Micheline and Mark Bagley back in 1993 fused together to create

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a five headed hybrid symbiote, which would have been, I assume,

Unknown:

the two headed symbiote that this movie tried to put

Unknown:

together. But I guess budget was an issue. So, yeah, um, all

Unknown:

these names, we wouldn't actually get them until, like,

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20 years later in another MARVEL Future comic where they had to

Unknown:

face off against carnage. But let's talk about the granddaddy

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of them all. No Who was first introduced in Venom comics, but

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he got his full origin story revealed in issue number four in

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2018 written by Donnie Cates and Ryan Ryan Stegman. Now I gotta

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say, reading through the. Comic, especially the introduction of

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it. I this was my first time kind of going through it, so I'm

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still reading through it. But from the big event that he had

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about the king in black, which was the summer event that took

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place back in 2020 from across Marvel stories, Noel explains

Unknown:

that he was basically the only being in the universe back in

Unknown:

the day at since its existence, it was just him and his kingdom

Unknown:

the void, aka space. He was just floating around aimlessly, doing

Unknown:

his own thing, until one day, the darkness of his space was

Unknown:

interrupted by a bright light and the gentrifying, gentrifying

Unknown:

force of the Celestials. Damn it, the lattes are going to be

Unknown:

more expensive. So with their presence, they brought light and

Unknown:

new worlds that occupied his space. So in a fit of rage

Unknown:

because he's losing his property, he takes the shadow

Unknown:

that is being casted from his body, and pulls a blade out and

Unknown:

uses that dark blade to cut off the head of one of the

Unknown:

Celestials. And I'm glad that you brought them guardians,

Unknown:

because that, my friends, is how Guardians of the Galaxy got

Unknown:

their home of nowhere. Ah, okay, okay. Sharp, sharp blade. Sharp

Unknown:

blade guy. Now Noel will turn this into a 1v 20 plus against

Unknown:

the Celestials. And unfortunately he does lose this

Unknown:

battle a little bit, and they banish him to the world Forge,

Unknown:

which we saw in um Avengers Infinity War, where Thor would

Unknown:

make storm breaker, but no obviously did not hear Nobel. So

Unknown:

he spent his entire time in forge working and building a new

Unknown:

weapon that he can use against the celestials to take back his

Unknown:

kingdom. And that is how we got the proto symbiote. This was a

Unknown:

being, but more so, like an armor and a weapon that he can

Unknown:

use to morph onto his body and car injure any weapon that he

Unknown:

ever wanted. And as Noel recounts the story of how he

Unknown:

created it, he said he tells the story of how he was injured

Unknown:

during this battle. So he unfortunately, was at his full

Unknown:

potential. So during this time, he had to use the fire that was

Unknown:

from the Forge, and the heat and the and the hammering of the

Unknown:

celestial hammer, Hammer that he stole to enforce his will onto

Unknown:

the proto symbiote, leading to the symbiote, this proto Symbio

Unknown:

taking on weaknesses from both fire and sound, which will then

Unknown:

be transferred down to his descendants. Okay, ties together

Unknown:

nicely. Now with this new weapon, it's round two, but

Unknown:

another defeat. Not as bad, though, because as Noel is

Unknown:

recovering on a nearby planet, he realizes that the suit that

Unknown:

he has can put itself onto any other smaller animal, and this

Unknown:

proto symbiote will create an offspring that will create a

Unknown:

symbiotic relationship with a lesser being. And this created

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the first Venom like host, this first symbiote host. So with

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that, he took his time, he grew his power, influencing and

Unknown:

putting his will with the proto symbiote to create more

Unknown:

symbiotes, and ultimately it will lead to him even creating a

Unknown:

symbiote Dragon, which honestly looks so freaking cool if you

Unknown:

ever check it out. Um, this dragon, though, caught the

Unknown:

attention of Thor when it was antagonizing some people, and

Unknown:

Thor defeated the creature, and it was such a sounding defeat

Unknown:

that it snapped the control that no had over all the symbiotes

Unknown:

that he created. Because with the proto symbiote, he was

Unknown:

created able to create a hive mind and force HIS WILL onto

Unknown:

them. And this is where we get like, kind of like that

Unknown:

explanation in the movie, where he was then the symbiotes now,

Unknown:

but in the more obviously, because the comic provides a bit

Unknown:

more detail, the symbiotes, after bonding with so many

Unknown:

beings who wanted to do good, they also created their own

Unknown:

sense of good, and they realized that their master was putting

Unknown:

them On a wrongful path, so they bonded together, went after null

Unknown:

and took him down in this huge battle where they locked him in

Unknown:

a cage, similar to what we saw here. And this also, will also

Unknown:

want to say that Thor would not face off. This is not the last

Unknown:

time that Thor would end up facing off against like a

Unknown:

creature of null, or some kind of byproduct of null, because

Unknown:

the same armor that null had, the same blade, the same thing

Unknown:

he used, would find its way into the hands of a being that would

Unknown:

slay, or, some might say, Gore, a God. So all this time. Time

Unknown:

The aftermath of nulls presence is echoing through the Marvel

Unknown:

Universe, between

Unknown:

Thor versus the god Slayer, the location of nowhere, how it was

Unknown:

created and then now this is where we see that the symbiotes

Unknown:

have locked away null in what was more recently explained the

Unknown:

planet of symbiotes, which was called clintar. But we learned

Unknown:

that clintar is actually not a planet. It is actually no in the

Unknown:

middle and 1000s upon 1000s of symbiotes swirling around,

Unknown:

keeping him locked in and preventing him from moving. And

Unknown:

clintar is actually their word for cage. So now that we have

Unknown:

that backstory, we do get the creation of the Knowles, kind of

Unknown:

like rise to power. He does break free, but the Codex issue,

Unknown:

this is the thing that is very confusing in this movie, so I'm

Unknown:

gonna try to see if I explain it quickly, because it does play

Unknown:

out more so in the king in black. But once again, yes, if a

Unknown:

symbiote saves his host from dying, it does create a codex.

Unknown:

And it's not just venom, as is shown in the movie. Codexes are

Unknown:

very basically. It's like going playing Pokemon, and just like

Unknown:

happening on the caterpi in the very first stages of after you

Unknown:

leave Pallet Town. So there are 1000s of codexes, but each one

Unknown:

is a separate key, and each every as many cases you can

Unknown:

collect, leads into no being able to escape. So that is why,

Unknown:

even though they kind of hyped it up like it was like no was

Unknown:

going to be able to free himself after just defeating Venom one

Unknown:

time. In reality, he would need several then um, symbiotes in

Unknown:

order to do this. And even speaking about venom, the name

Unknown:

actually comes from the fact where null was fighting against

Unknown:

the symbiotes, he says they've been infected by a virus or even

Unknown:

a venom. So that's why venom is the more popular symbiote of

Unknown:

within the Marvel Universe, even though lash guy, fire lash guy,

Unknown:

I'm voting for him, yeah. So yeah, that is it. No, I'm

Unknown:

actually pretty impressed with the story that they crafted for

Unknown:

him in comics, especially because of the fact that he has

Unknown:

such a strong connection to some of those unanswered questions

Unknown:

that we've had in the Marvel Universe, and then eventually

Unknown:

his hand in create, and not only the creation of certain villains

Unknown:

or spaces, but also, like fact, he killed the celestial which I

Unknown:

know that Marvel has been toying around with now, I don't know

Unknown:

how if they are still, because I know the Eternals two is no

Unknown:

longer on the block. No thanks. All right, but I be shocked to

Unknown:

see how they if no is going to be a bigger character in the

Unknown:

future, and if it's going to be a Sony production, or if it's

Unknown:

going to be a Marvel production, especially because they're at

Unknown:

the right moment, right now, where there's no real villain,

Unknown:

like we are just relying on, you know, the phase out of Kang and

Unknown:

then hopefully Dr Doom, now played by Robert Downey Jr,

Unknown:

becoming the thing, which I don't know if it will. I don't,

Unknown:

to be honest, I don't have that much confidence that this

Unknown:

version of Dr Doom would be as big, because, you know, there's

Unknown:

only really two. Like, he's a great character in the comics,

Unknown:

but it'd be very hard to introduce someone who doesn't

Unknown:

have such a like we have Thanos, who has such a rich history with

Unknown:

the things going on behind the scenes. And until I see

Unknown:

something with Dr Doom happening with that in the Marvel

Unknown:

Universe, I feel like no should really make this hop over. If

Unknown:

the plan is for him to hop over to the Marvel Universe as soon

Unknown:

as possible, or they'll put him in Spider Man for the

Unknown:

multiverse, as was the bled all along. All right. So with that,

Unknown:

that wraps up the comic book knowledge. That also wraps up

Unknown:

our episode. Any final thoughts about venom, three last dance.

Unknown:

Sony, just stop. Please, please. It's yeah, look, we get it. We

Unknown:

get it. The money is great, but come on with these movies, man,

Unknown:

if you're not going to try stop doing it, all right, we'd rather

Unknown:

never see these characters, then you do this every three months.

Unknown:

Please, please stop. It's just, just work on the working

Unknown:

conditions of what we've been hearing about, the working

Unknown:

conditions for the spider verse movies, and just give us the

Unknown:

enjoyment that we know could be a great film. And don't have to

Unknown:

worry about feeling like you have to check every single box

Unknown:

or every single person. Just make your story. We will find

Unknown:

ways to enjoy it same way we did with our first two films here.

Unknown:

All right, that wraps up our episode. Be sure to support us,

Unknown:

either through a one time gift, buy me a coffee, or monthly

Unknown:

through Patreon, check us out on our socials for updates on our

Unknown:

episodes as. Can find across Apple, Spotify, YouTube or many

Unknown:

other platforms. If you ever want to reach out to us, be sure

Unknown:

to either send us a DM on our social medias, or you can also

Unknown:

reach out to capercappod@gmail.com Take care

Unknown:

of yourselves and remember that. I guess if you got some kind of

Unknown:

trauma, just follow the advice of Dr Christmas and Dr temple,

Unknown:

because 90% of the time taking on the symbiote might just solve

Unknown:

that somehow. And if your job involves you working near a pit

Unknown:

of acid that is outdoors, quit it ain't worth it because you're

Unknown:

gonna get burned by acid 100% guaranteed. Thanks again for

Unknown:

listening. If you liked what you heard, press that follow button

Unknown:

and share us with the four. With a friend. And don't forget, you

Unknown:

can always see more updates and content on our social media

Unknown:

accounts, just by searching at Cape or cap you.

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About the Podcast

Cape or Cap: A Black Nerd Superhero Podcast
Fun deep dives and honest takes on superhero productions from two Black Nerds breaking down what’s worth your time ('cape') and what you can skip ('cap')
Cape or Cap: A Black Nerd Superhero Podcast is the perfect place for dissecting superhero shows, movies, and their source material comics from a Black nerd's perspective.

Join Chamar "ComicChams" Griffith and Andrew "Arete" Tejada as they delve into the stories, behind-the-scenes work, and comic origins of these productions. They provide a final review to let you know which ones are worth a watch and have earned their 'cape', and which ones have crash-landed and earned a 'cap'. Expect reviews, lightning rounds, and plenty of nerdy banter in every episode. Available wherever you get your podcasts.
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About your hosts

Chamar Griffith

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A Blerd from birth, Chamar is just a kid from Brooklyn who has always loved epic tales, art, and animation. Given that superheroes and cartoons have all three, he dived into this colorful world.

Andrew Tejada

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